Are we having Global Warming, or not ??

[gardenfairy]

Here's something I found really interesting and for me right on the money.

 

[gardenfairy]

You guys are still saying a whole lot facts. But where do you get your information from? You can't have a true debate with out facts and where you got them from. Otherwise its just hearsay and the debate is pointless.

 

[gardenfairy]

Here's a site:
http://www.epa.gov/climatechange/basics/facts.html
What is the evidence that proves the climate is changing?
The global average temperature increased by more than 1.4°F over the last century. [2] In fact, according to the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA), the decade from 2000 to 2010 was the warmest on record, and 2010 was tied with 2005 as the warmest year on record. [3] Rising global temperatures have also been accompanied by other changes in weather and climate. Many places have experienced changes in rainfall resulting in more intense rain, as well as more frequent and severe heat waves. The planet's oceans and glaciers have also experienced changes: oceans are warming and becoming more acidic, ice caps are melting, and sea levels are rising. [4] All of these changes are evidence that our world is getting warmer.

 

[gardenfairy]

Maybe if your a nay sayer you maybe could use this site:
http://ossfoundation.us/projects/environment/global-warming/myths
40'S TO 70'S COOLING, CO2 RISING?
This is a fascinating denialist argument. If CO2 is rising, as it was in the 40's through the 70's, why would there be cooling?

 

[headfullofbees]

Everyone is entitled to their opinions after all

Not if it adds 10p per litre to the cost of petrol they're not.

 

[Chuck]

I heard a lot of ifs, maybes and speculations but nothing involving facts that climate change is man made. If man is the culprit will raising taxes and enacting Cap and Trade change anything? Especially when everything in the entire world is based on the use of fossil fuels. There is not one thing, used or made or grown, that isn't somehow linked to fossil fuels. Even green energy is impossible without them. So what does the entire human race do? Revert back to the 1800's? Ban refridgeration because it uses too much energy? How about all of us walking everywhere we go? What is it that you doom sayers really want? I guess the entire human population on earth could commit mass suicide. That would stop man made climate change and global warming pretty fast I suppose.
But if climate change is not man made then the entire argument is moot and nothing can be done except adapt, and that has been done throughout history and quite a few changes in the climate as well.

 

[headfullofbees]

Here's a site:
http://www.epa.gov/climatechange/basics/facts.html
What is the evidence that proves the climate is changing?
The global average temperature increased by more than 1.4°F over the last century. [2] In fact, according to the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA), the decade from 2000 to 2010 was the warmest on record, and 2010 was tied with 2005 as the warmest year on record. [3] Rising global temperatures have also been accompanied by other changes in weather and climate. Many places have experienced changes in rainfall resulting in more intense rain, as well as more frequent and severe heat waves. The planet's oceans and glaciers have also experienced changes: oceans are warming and becoming more acidic, ice caps are melting, and sea levels are rising. [4] All of these changes are evidence that our world is getting warmer.

No-one is saying that change isn't happening. No-one is saying that the world isn't getting warmer.
If you think about it though, the very fact that we constantly get further into an interglacial period DEMANDS that the planet gets warmer.
Sea levels rise and fall all the time, and have done without man's help

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/5076322.stm

http://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/2010/10/01/sea-level-falling-in-2010/

http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=sea level falling&qpvt=sea level falling&FORM=IGRE

http://www.tmgnow.com/repository/global/sea_level.html

http://iceagenow.com/Arctic_Sea_Level_Falling.htm

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...ea-level-upsets-theory-of-global-warming.html

http://wattsupwiththat.com/2012/02/03/quantifying-sea-level-fall/

http://joannenova.com.au/2012/10/australian-sea-levels-have-been-falling-for-7000-years/

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/08/20/climate_change_made_sea_levels_fall_in_2010_and_2011/

 

[Livvy]

This is utter nonsense.

The name change from "Global Warming" to "Climate Change" happened because we have had SEVENTEEN YEARS of no heating, and, in fact, marginal cooling.

Oh really? Well I'm sure you'll be more than willing to provide us with evidence as to your claims then, won't you?

By using just a little common sense it would seem that the climate is perpetually changing. Now I want some proof and not just a bunch of oral flatulence from a bunch of acedemics who claim to be scientists that in fact it is getting warmer, that these latest spring and summer thunder storms, the floods, the heat, the cold are something new. That man is at fault for it all. That my light bulb and SUV are going to destroy the world. Just a little proof is all

Ahhh see there's your problem right there. You keep demanding proof, yet provide none of your own, and then when someone comes out and says, "Okay here's your proof" you disregard them as 'a bunch of academics who claim to be scientists'. So, why don't you go ahead and do what you're asking others to do, and stop spouting off a bunch of oral flatulence, and actually provide verifiable evidence as to your claims as Gardenfairy has so kindly done?

Even the findings of the great Albert Einstein are still categorized as THEORY, not fact! Is the evidence of man-made global warming of greater significance than Einstein's theory of relativity? Has the theory of man-made global warming been tested to nearly the same degree as Einstein's theories? Not even close. In fact, anyone daring to challenge, question, or doubt this theory of man-made global warming (climate change, whatever you want to call it) is met with anger and name-calling and being labeled as a "denier". LOL!! This is science? No, it is not. This is politics. You are being duped. Engage in critical thinking along with mature research and you'll find this issue is really very simple to understand.

It is oh so good that you tell others to wake up, and to actually look into things.

It's just such a shame that you couldn't do the same thing. It really is, because while you may have had some good points, the fact that you don't know basic science kind of throws your entire argument under the bus.

The findings of Einstein are still categorized as a theory, that is true. Do you know what a theory means? Because it's obvious that you do not. No, I'm not personally attacking you, or calling you stupid, so please don't start with that. I'm talking seriously here;you do not know what a theory means. Or at least, you think that a theory means the same thing you think it means.

A theory is the highest a scientific idea can get. There is no science fact. All things we know to be true, let's say, gravity for instance are theories. Are you going to also claim that gravity is just a theory I wonder? Do you also use this defense when people talk about the Theory of Evolution, and say 'Oh well if it's just a theory then Creationism could still happen!'?

Engage in some critical thinking along with mature research-something you have obviously failed to do up until now-and you will find that in the scientific community, and this has been true for centuries, when something is declared a theory that's as close as the community gets to saying, "We are 110% behind this idea. This idea is correct, can never be proven to be incorrect, and if this idea were a person, I would have it's babies!"

Because we like to actually leave a little room for error. Just in case. We're talking 99.9999999999999999999999999% etc factually correct. But there's always that tiny little percent. And so, gravity, global warming, Einstein's Theory of Relativity, and yes, Evolution, are all called theories. Because they are all considered to be 99.99999999999999% etc correct by the scientific community at large.

But you knew that already, didn't you? After all, you engage in mature research and critical thinking, don't you? You'd never have difficulty understanding an issue which is really very easy to understand, would you?

 

[zigs]

Oh really? Well I'm sure you'll be more than willing to provide us with evidence as to your claims then, won't you?

I think you'll find that Bees just did.

What we're saying is that we accept climate change is happening, but we don't think its caused by the reasons that are being dictated to us.

How can it be mankind's CO2 productions when we have the lowest CO2 levels for 300 million years?

 

[headfullofbees]

 

[Becky]

I'm still seeing a lot of aggressive language folks - please refer to my post above. If you can't put across a your point of view without getting angry at other members then please do not reply to this topic.

Here's something I found really interesting and for me right on the money.

That's an interesting video, but it makes the assumption that global climate change is entirely man made and therefore can be changed through our own efforts... However I do agree that action is required to change how we live - whether or not climate change is man made seems to be irrelevant, humans cannot continue to live in such an unsustainable way. It's not us we need to think about - it's the generations ahead. Whatever your opinion on climate change, I think we can all agree that cutting down the rain forests will never be a good thing, neither will our reliance on fossil fuels, or the way we are polluting the oceans. The debate on climate change just seems to get in the way of taking action, and I can't see that any good can come from it.

To summarise my view, I believe that if climate change is wholly/partly man-made we should change how we live to be more sustainable. If climate change is a natural occurrence then we should change how we live to be more sustainable.

 

[Chuck]

I sure am glad that CO2 levels are not shrinking. Just think 10000 years ago at the end of the last ice age CO2 levels were 180ppm down from the high of 7000ppm during the Cambrian period. Just a slight change in temps and climate wouldn't you agree? If high CO2 levels make the climate warmer just think how hot it must have been when the levels were 7000 and they are 400 now. Must have been around 250F. And yet the earth was a gigantic jungle just waiting for T-Rex to arrive. Now I don't want the CO2 levels to rise to 7000 because I couldn't afford to run the Air Conditioner but I would sure rather it to be a few degrees warmer and be able to feed myself than colder when agriculture is impossible. My rototiller doesn't work very well when the ground is frozen. Bees, we must be vigilant and and keep our eyes peeled toward the heavens because I keep hearing the sky is going to fall. Too much CO2 up there I hear

 

[limcid]

It's just such a shame that you couldn't do the same thing. It really is, because while you may have had some good points, the fact that you don't know basic science kind of throws your entire argument under the bus.

But, you ignore those good points and focus on other things.

The findings of Einstein are still categorized as a theory, that is true. Do you know what a theory means? Because it's obvious that you do not. No, I'm not personally attacking you, or calling you stupid, so please don't start with that. I'm talking seriously here;you do not know what a theory means. Or at least, you think that a theory means the same thing you think it means.

No, you're talking sewiously.

A theory is the highest a scientific idea can get. There is no science fact. All things we know to be true, let's say, gravity for instance are theories. Are you going to also claim that gravity is just a theory I wonder? Do you also use this defense when people talk about the Theory of Evolution, and say 'Oh well if it's just a theory then Creationism could still happen!'?

Our understanding of gravity is not etched in stone. We don't understand it, yet. We have theories that are evolving.

Engage in some critical thinking along with mature research-something you have obviously failed to do up until now-and you will find that in the scientific community, and this has been true for centuries, when something is declared a theory that's as close as the community gets to saying, "We are 110% behind this idea. This idea is correct, can never be proven to be incorrect, and if this idea were a person, I would have it's babies!"

Sorry, but that's totally incorrect. You should check out some of the very latest science-based documentaries (the real ones, not the youtube-basement creations).

Because we like to actually leave a little room for error. Just in case. We're talking 99.9999999999999999999999999% etc factually correct. But there's always that tiny little percent. And so, gravity, global warming, Einstein's Theory of Relativity, and yes, Evolution, are all called theories. Because they are all considered to be 99.99999999999999% etc correct by the scientific community at large.

Incorrect.

But you knew that already, didn't you? After all, you engage in mature research and critical thinking, don't you? You'd never have difficulty understanding an issue which is really very easy to understand, would you?

I think some of your understanding is the product of preference.

Now, what about that Sun of ours? Don't be angry at people like me, be angry at those that are selling you this hoax.

 

[Livvy]

Wow, you sure proved me wrong there Limicid, what with all those well reasoned arguments.

Oh no wait, all you did was say 'No that's wrong'. Tell you what, why don't you actually prove your points instead of just saying that I'm wrong? For example, why don't you actually point us to to these 'very latest science-based documentaries', which you believe backs up your idea of what a theory is.

Because as I have said, a scientific theory is not what you claim it to be.

I think you'll find that Bees just did.

No, he didn't. I asked him to back up the claim that the reason it was changed from Global Warming to Global climate change was because of the world cooling. Which he did not do.

 

[Becky]

I can't see that any good is going to come from this topic remaining open, which is a shame.