How did our Ancestors Outwit the Cabbage White?

[Susan BBPM]

So many gardeners in the UK will tell you that they don't bother growing brassicas because it's so difficult fending off the pests (primarily cabbage white).

Even some experienced youtube veg gardeners give up. Most will tell you the only way is to build brassica cages.

This got me thinking - how did brassicas ever become part of the British diet if they were so difficult to grow? Our ancestors didn't have time to baby their veg - they had work to do. Getting hold of netting would be difficult back then.

So what gives? Is the cabbage white problem a more recent vulnerability?

 

[Oliver Buckle]

I think they may have been more like the dwarf at Frodo's feast, "I never did trust food that's green." More seriously, it is worth growing high calorie foods, wheat, barley, turnips and such, but the hedgerows are full of green stuff if you know which is which. The people in the big house probably gave the gardener's boy a net, or had him picking caterpillars, no shortage of labour for the rich.

 

[Susan BBPM]

I think they may have been more like the dwarf at Frodo's feast, "I never did trust food that's green." More seriously, it is worth growing high calorie foods, wheat, barley, turnips and such, but the hedgerows are full of green stuff if you know which is which. The people in the big house probably gave the gardener's boy a net, or had him picking caterpillars, no shortage of labour for the rich.

Reasearch shows that Victorian Brits in the UK ate brassicas.

The real cabbage soup diet: What Britons ate down the ages

Ancient Britons were eating dairy, peas, cabbage and oats, according to gunk trapped in their teeth.

www.bbc.co.uk

Also, it's known that peasants in medieval times ate brassicas:

"Peasants grew a variety of vegetables and fruits on their small plots of land, including cabbage, onions, leeks, carrots, and turnips."

What Did Medieval Peasants Eat? - TheMedievalGuide

Learn about the diet of medieval peasants and what they ate for each meal including breakfast, lunch, and dinner.

www.themedievalguide.com

"Stews (or pottages) comprising meat (beef and mutton) and vegetables (such as cabbage and leek) were the basis of the medieval peasant diet, according to the results."

What kind of food did peasants eat? | - From Hunger To Hope

Peasants ate a variety of food, but they primarily consumed grains and vegetables. They would eat bread made from wheat or barley, porridge (oatmeal), and other cereals such as millet, rye, and oats. Peasants ate mostly bread and porridge. Read more in detail here: what did peasants eat for...

fromhungertohope.com

When you consider how difficult modern day gardeners find it to grow brassicas, you have to wonder if the cabbage white is a recent problem. I don't think they'd waste time and energy trying to grow something likely to be decimated overnight by bugs?

OR....
Have brassicas been 'improved' over the years to the point where they're very vulnerable? For example, wild strawberries are bulletproof yet the big, tasty, modern strawberries are targeted by all sorts of pests.

 

[Oliver Buckle]

Hands up, it was a wild guess that seemed a bit humorous.

Another 'OR'
Was it that the human population was much smaller meaning cultivation was not continuous? There were large tracts of 'wild' between the cultivated bits, so butterflies did not achieve the density of population. I reckon present day populations are dense enough that the population could be continuous from me to you, but then they might have been small populations isolated from each other

Looking at ways to control the population I would note wasps are heavy predators, and checking the underside of leaves can catch eggs and baby caterpillars before there is too much damage.

 

[Susan BBPM]

I've given up on them. They're just too much work and take up too much space. This year I tried growing them in containers in a big netted cage on the patio. They actually did OK - no pest damage and nice and healthy. But too much work watering, feeding, potting up.
I've decided my time is better spent elsewhere and I'm composting the lot tomorrow.

That's what got me thinking - did grandad grow brassicas? He wouldn't have bothered if it was this difficult. Yet if you look at all the 'dig for victory' photos it's all cauliflower and cabbages. Did people with small gardens in cities really dedicate their valuable space to brassicas? If so, then something has changed - either the brassicas or the environment.

 

[Susan BBPM]

I've found the answer to what they did during the war - applied chemicals!!

https://dig-for-victory.org.uk/growing-advice/dig-victory-leaflets-ww2/garden-pests/leather-jackets-slugs-flea-beetles-aphids-caterpillars/

 

[Oliver Buckle]

I have been searching for a book since I read your post and can't find it. It is about vegetable growing, was written in the 1920's when dad won an open scholarship to read agriculture, it is written by two lady gardeners with good quality qualifications. 1920's remember. Anyway at one point they are talking about 'modern' chemicals to help the gardener, but go on to say there will always be a place for staples like lime, white and red lead and arsenic. hmmm.

 

[redback]

There is an organically approved "dipel" spray that only causes the caterpillars loss of appetite.
I have a 20 year old vegetable patch with so many predators that the cabbage moth is quickly eaten. You might consider weeding less to encourage biodiversity.

 

[Susan BBPM]

There is an organically approved "dipel" spray that only causes the caterpillars loss of appetite.
I have a 20 year old vegetable patch with so many predators that the cabbage moth is quickly eaten. You might consider weeding less to encourage biodiversity.

I have wondered about whether that would work. In fact, that's what prompted the thread.

However, I've seen so many permaculture experts on youtube finally admit that the only way to grow brassicas is with netting. This is specifically the UK I'm talking about - in this country, as far as I can tell, no one manages to grow brassicas with out chemicals, nets or HUGE amounts of work picking off the bugs. That includes the editors of Permaculture Magazine - and they have contact with permaculture gardeners all over the country. They tried and concluded it can't be done.

It does suggest that something has gone very wrong here as I can't imagine our ancestors putting in this much work for a bit of cabbage!

Out of interest, what eats the cabbage white?

 

[redback]

I have wondered about whether that would work. In fact, that's what prompted the thread.

However, I've seen so many permaculture experts on youtube finally admit that the only way to grow brassicas is with netting. This is specifically the UK I'm talking about - in this country, as far as I can tell, no one manages to grow brassicas with out chemicals, nets or HUGE amounts of work picking off the bugs. That includes the editors of Permaculture Magazine - and they have contact with permaculture gardeners all over the country. They tried and concluded it can't be done.

It does suggest that something has gone very wrong here as I can't imagine our ancestors putting in this much work for a bit of cabbage!

Out of interest, what eats the cabbage white?

One day I was looking at the rain from my bedroom window. A sparrow took cover under the broccoli, just beneath the window, and emerged with a green caterpillar in its beak. Whether he taught all the other sparrows to look up when under a brassica leaf, I don't know. Generally, I don't see who preys on who, but there are several suspects big enough to do the deed. Red wasps and yellow wasps fly around with a green caterpillar hanging underneath. Skinks often lurk, looking suspicious, and ants definitely feast on caterpillars. There are hover flies, grey fantails, willy wagtails, blue tongues, lacewings and the neighbor's cat. All are seen hiding in the grass at various times.

 

[headfullofbees]

Cabbage white butterflies can only lay eggs if they land on three brassica leaves in a row.
If they land on something else, they reset to zero.
In order to have the best chance, plant other leafy greens like lettuce vaieties, chard, etc or plants which have leaves like beans etc.
If you plant one brassica to 2 or 3 others, you have a good chance of outwitting them.
If you use a foliar fed actively-aerated bacterial compost tea, with a little extra molasses every two to three weeks, that makes the leaves indigestible to the caterpillars.

 

[redback]

The holes in the brassica leaves of the second photo are from a hailstorm, but you can see the plants thrive untouched by pests amongst the grass.

 

[redback]

On the sunny north slope of the tank plateau I have planted a variety of herbs and tough flowering plants. When a punnett of my broccoli seedlings were covered in aphid I took them out of the hothouse and placed them here. Within 5 hours all the aphid were gone and the droopy plants were perky again. I can recommend areas of non-vegetables placed around the garden.