Lets talk Artificial Fertilizers

[redback]

Since Meadowlark is here and interested, I will point to other interesting notes from Dr Jones lecture.
1. K stays put and builds banks of K in the soil. N is mobile and abundant. Both cannot be used by plants unless the soil microorganisms are activated.
2. Rhizosheaths are killed by high-analysis inorganic fertilizer. Nitrogen production of plants needs the low-oxygen environment of the rhizosheaths.

 

[Meadowlark]

... Some might have the same since I suspect some only use NPK as correctional factors.

and some only talk about it and don't actually grow hands-on. We call that "All hat, and no cattle" in Texas.

Come on artificials...prove me wrong!!

 

[Meadowlark]

...
1. K stays put and builds banks of K in the soil. N is mobile and abundant. Both cannot be used by plants unless the soil microorganisms are activated.

Yes, already knew that. N fixing covers provide abundant long lasting N2

2. Rhizosheaths are killed by high-analysis inorganic fertilizer. Nitrogen production of plants needs the low-oxygen environment of the rhizosheaths.

Yes, have previously been aware of that.

 

[redback]

The best YouTube video is 'Dr C. Jones 'Green Cover Seed - Cover cropping for Carbon Capture Apr.2021'
About mid lecture she has an illustration of 'desirable team members for cover crops'. The drawing shows the varying root depths and above ground heights of 10 plants. They are chosen for - soil carbon capture - N,P capture - water balance - biomass production - beneficial insects and soil microbial activity.

 

[redback]

Just want to say that I appreciate the pride and conviction of organic and permaculture advocates, but their tendency to ‘bash’ synthetic ferts unrelentingly is off-putting to say the least. Your way works for you and other ways work for others. Acceptance of different techniques makes for a much more harmonious forum.

The subject is controversial. Roadrunner recommended the video of - 'Garden Fundamentals' - with a bloke who came close to being neutral. He was almost about to say 'organic fertilizer is accumulative' when he stopped short.
This shows how difficult it is to be neutral.
Organic fertilizers are accumulative while soluble inorganic fertilizers need to be renewed each year.

 

[Meadowlark]

...
The ability to address eficiencies quickly is one factor definitely in favor of use of synthetics.

My soil that has been prepared for planting veggies, routinely scientifically tests "No N, P, K, required" and above 90% nutrient density scores. The only deficiency is lack of boron which I fix before planting brassicas.

I do not need or want artificials to fix what isn't broke. If you do, fine for you, but not for me.

Now, show us some of your root crops growing with artificial fertilizers...

 

[Mr_Yan]

Both [N and K] cannot be used by plants unless the soil microorganisms are activated.

Related to this I see people constantly struggle up here planting things out too cold - even if the air is warm enough the ground is often still cold. The microbe networks don't "wake up" again when cold and all the nice looking seedling starts languish after planting out. If they survive they'll still lag ones where the plant out date was pushed back to let the ground warm up.

 

[redback]

this piece of grass has the soil clustered around its roots indicating that it too is producing nitrogen in the oxygen poor area of the rhizosheath and the roots are feeding the microbes.

 

[cpp gardener]

Once again the bashing commences unabated and uncompromisingly.
I don’t bother with veggies, that’s what the grocery store is for (go ahead and bash, it’s what I expect). When I have grown them, they had roots just like that. I’ll check out some stuff at work and get back to you.
Yippie for you Larkie and Redback, glad you like to grow your way. I like to grow my way, the results please me. I’m not out to put people down, denigrate others who disagree with me or act like a complete asshole. I want to talk about fertilizers and plants. Once again, I grow things my way and get great results. Millions of other gardeners grow in essentially the same way, have great results and don’t poison soil. Miracle-gro wouldn’t be a multibillion dollar business if all their products killed plants and people willy-nilly.
If you don’t want to discuss synthetic fertilizers and how to use them, why don’t you go to another thread and discuss how wonderfully virtuous you are for growing plants the way you want to and leave the rest of us alone?

 

[Oliver Buckle]

In my garden it tends to mean it is a particularly stick bit of clay there

 

[cpp gardener]

I found a couple of weeds for examples of root systems in synthetically fertilized areas. Let me know if the root systems differ radically from wha5 you expect.

 

[Meadowlark]

...I don’t bother with veggies, that’s what the grocery store is for...

A defining quote worth remembering...posted on Gardening Forums on a thread discussing artificial fertilizers Feb. 2, 2023

 

[cpp gardener]

There is more to gardening than vegetables. I have a less than 1/2 acre yard in the suburbs that I don't own. I can only do so much and have only so much time. I choose to use my time and energy growing ornamental plants. You have your preferences and I have mine.
There are 20 different forums on this site and many people on them use synthetic fertilizers with great success. There is a forum for Organic Gardening that should appeal to you and could probably benefit from your experience and knowledge. This thread is about Artificial (synthetic) Fertilizers. If you have information and experience that would help someone interested in the use of synthetic fertilizers please feel free to post it. Simply and constantly denigrating, insulting and belittling others that grow things with synthetics is neither helpful nor polite.

 

[Tetters]

Once again the bashing commences unabated and uncompromisingly.
I don’t bother with veggies, that’s what the grocery store is for (go ahead and bash, it’s what I expect). When I have grown them, they had roots just like that.

I don't see the need for any fertilisers at all on my flowers and shrubs. They manage just fine in the soil as it is.
Growing food, I believe will very soon become a must for people who don/t want to starve, as the crops that are bought at the grocery store will no doubt dwindle. Have you noticed how many farmers in the ''western world'' are leading a revolt - as their farms are attacked from all sides.

 

[Tetters]

If you have information and experience that would help someone interested in the use of synthetic fertilizers please feel free to post it. Simply and constantly denigrating, insulting and belittling others that grow things with synthetics is neither helpful nor polite.

Surely the subject allows opinion on for and against a gardening method. It is for the reader then to decide if one method - or another is what they prefer to use.
I have not noticed Meadowlark's comments to ever be rude or impolite, but it might be a good idea to cool down a bit.