Trimming non-sucker limb on tomato plant question.

Joined
May 8, 2022
Messages
48
Reaction score
35
Location
North Hampshire
Country
United Kingdom
And of course I plant mine extremely deeply with an average of 18 to 20 inches of stem underground. I grow my heirlooms beef toms 1 ft apart in the greenhouse wrapping around two canes 12 inches apart at the base and tied together at the top. This allows me to get 10ft long stems only 5 and a half high. I remove all side shoots and all leaves under each truss once the fruit is pea sized. I end up with 6 or 7 trusses with a bare stem under them. I feed 1/2 strenth tomato feed with Epsom salt added.
Even my outdoor salad and cherry tomatoes are planted extra deep which gives me a greater rooted stem. As seen in a photo I posted earlier.
 
Joined
Mar 26, 2013
Messages
3,476
Reaction score
1,531
Location
Port William
Showcase(s):
1
Country
United Kingdom
There is no purpose to planting deeply if you are supporting the plants & growing them indoors.
The tap root will do what the buried roots can't.
 
Joined
May 8, 2022
Messages
48
Reaction score
35
Location
North Hampshire
Country
United Kingdom
Sorry but I disagree, the additional roots help the plant against any stress that may occur. I have found that I get a better crop with more trusses using this system as I have grown both ways side by side. I don't know why or how but it works, just seen that it does.
If you don't like the way I grow mine then do it your own way .
 
Joined
Feb 13, 2021
Messages
3,433
Reaction score
2,146
Country
United Kingdom
I have seen the argument before that roots from the stem do nothing to feed the plant but only provide extra support. Apart from the fact that extra support can't really be a bad thing I can't see why we should believe roots don't take up moisture or nourishment. It is a normal function of roots, and I don't see how it would be possible to prove they don't. Planting side by side may give an indication, but without grading the soil for an even distribution of nutrient and moisture to a considerable depth and repeating it a large number of times it is not conclusive. My plants all planted the same way in the same border, with the same imported earth, often grow very differently.
Meanwhile there is enough of a chance it is going to help I shall be trying a couple of beefsteaks with Tincasteve's method next year. I have some seeds my missus brought back from holiday that should be just the thing.
 
Joined
Mar 26, 2013
Messages
3,476
Reaction score
1,531
Location
Port William
Showcase(s):
1
Country
United Kingdom
I have seen the argument before that roots from the stem do nothing to feed the plant but only provide extra support. Apart from the fact that extra support can't really be a bad thing I can't see why we should believe roots don't take up moisture or nourishment. It is a normal function of roots, and I don't see how it would be possible to prove they don't. Planting side by side may give an indication, but without grading the soil for an even distribution of nutrient and moisture to a considerable depth and repeating it a large number of times it is not conclusive. My plants all planted the same way in the same border, with the same imported earth, often grow very differently.
Meanwhile there is enough of a chance it is going to help I shall be trying a couple of beefsteaks with Tincasteve's method next year. I have some seeds my missus brought back from holiday that should be just the thing.
If they are quite happy at that depth, why do they:
1) Not naturally grow those roots at that depth?
2) Grow other roots on the surface?
3) Grow nothing between the old & new roots if you plant them deep enough?
4) Have a tap root, able to do anything those deep roots can do?
 

Meadowlark

No N-P-K Required
Joined
Feb 5, 2019
Messages
2,701
Reaction score
2,250
Location
East Texas
Hardiness Zone
old zone 8b/new zone 9a
Country
United States
...
If you don't like the way I grow mine then do it your own way .

Truer words were never spoken!!

..I can't see why we should believe roots don't take up moisture or nourishment. It is a normal function of roots, and I don't see how it would be possible to prove they don't.

Agree, and it certainly would not be worth the effort to prove they don't.
 
Joined
May 8, 2022
Messages
48
Reaction score
35
Location
North Hampshire
Country
United Kingdom
I don't need to prove anything to anybody. As an angler I go on 3 day sessions quite a lot so need the plants to look after themselves that's why I have the gutter system, self opening windows and the same mechanism for the door. So watering and air / insects are catered for. I know I get a better quality of tomato the way I do it. Very little splitting due to irregular watering and a very good set per truss. As my tomatoes are grown in buckets they are in a prison so need to be cared for. All roots on all plants take up water and nutrition so the way I see it my plants have an easier life , less chance of stress. I'm just letting every body know how I do it. You could always try it yourself, don't expect 100 % extra fruit from those naturally occurring stem roots though. Which brings to mind why does a tomato plant make those roots even when the stem is just laid on the soil ?
 
Joined
Mar 26, 2013
Messages
3,476
Reaction score
1,531
Location
Port William
Showcase(s):
1
Country
United Kingdom
When you bury a tomato very deeply, there is a space on the stem, where no leaves grow; you effectively have two sets of roots.
Ever thought of asking yourself why there is that space?
Roots CAN grow anywhere along the stem on indeterminate tomatoes, & that gap does not occur if they are planted shallower.
On the very deeply planted tomatoes WHY, if extra roots are beneficial, does the tomato plant choose not to grow roots in the space?
Remember, tomatoes have tap roots that can access water & nutrients FIVE FEET DOWN, & the surface roots need to BREATHE OXYGEN as well as drink.
What possible benefit could the tomato plant gain from growing an extra set of surface roots when it already has access to all the nutrients & water in a root system far better designed for the purpose?
The reason that very deeply planted tomatoes grow an extra set of roots, that do not reach all the way down the stem, is that it gains no benefit from those in the gap.
Logically, this means that if you plant them at a shallower depth, where the new roots DO reach the old ones, they are in the depth where there are no new roots grown on the very deeply planted tomatoes, & it thus follows that the old roots are no longer functioning, or merely sharing the same function to the same extent,
I don't need to prove anything to anybody. As an angler I go on 3 day sessions quite a lot so need the plants to look after themselves that's why I have the gutter system, self opening windows and the same mechanism for the door. So watering and air / insects are catered for. I know I get a better quality of tomato the way I do it. Very little splitting due to irregular watering and a very good set per truss. As my tomatoes are grown in buckets they are in a prison so need to be cared for. All roots on all plants take up water and nutrition so the way I see it my plants have an easier life , less chance of stress. I'm just letting every body know how I do it. You could always try it yourself, don't expect 100 % extra fruit from those naturally occurring stem roots though. Which brings to mind why does a tomato plant make those roots even when the stem is just laid on the soil ?

as they would were they buried at just the level you would with ordinary plants.

Certainly, you have every right to do whatever you like with your tomatoes, & I would not stop you if I could, but like I said before, this is a forum with many members, a lot of them relatively inexperienced & they should hear all views, preferably without the aggressive undertones.

If you lay a plant on its side it will produce roots all along the stem, because that's where they will be useful, however, they will take time to adjust, as the taproot will then have to regain its depth.
 
Joined
May 8, 2022
Messages
48
Reaction score
35
Location
North Hampshire
Country
United Kingdom
Sorry had to laugh, tap root 5ft down in a 18 x 12 inch square bucket.
As for a gap , well it could be because it's a vine and would naturally bend at that point until it could lay down. Other than that ain't got the faintest.
It just seems to help to have those extra roots, ain't nature fascinating.
 
Last edited:
Joined
May 19, 2022
Messages
25
Reaction score
2
Location
Arkansas
Country
United States
I have always heard and understood it that since tomato plants can get rather top heavy during peak fruition and the weight just from the plant itself, burying them deeper allows the extra roots to grow for additional support of the plant/vine..

But to each their own! That is why this is gardening not baking where you use a cookie cutter to make all the same shaped cookies! ... But now I want a cookie!!!
 
Joined
Feb 13, 2021
Messages
3,433
Reaction score
2,146
Country
United Kingdom
Evolution does not follow reason or logic, and even benefit is a doubtful criteria. Mutation is a random thing, if the mutation gives the organism a survival edge it will come to dominate in an overcrowded world, if it is merely different it may well co-exist, look at all the naturally occurring variety of things. If I wanted to know why a root or bud grew on a particular part of a stem I would look for physical reasons in the plant, such as the presence of a hormone, or its absence. Looking at it in terms of 'logic' or 'reason' is anthropomorphism and an outdated Lamarckian, rather than Darwinian, view of evolution.
Sorry, I really don't seem to have the hang of this 'reply' function. I don't know how I did that, that's my reply, not headfullofbees post.
 
Joined
Jul 28, 2014
Messages
66
Reaction score
30
Location
Almonte Ontario
Country
Canada
Yes, they were engineered that way, but why? Is it because hybrid tomato plants fruit all ripen in a fairly short period of time? Because if only the blooms on the main trunk were available to fruit, one wouldn't have nearly as many tomatoes would one? So why would one even think about pruning suckers?
I couldn't disagree more. I grow quite large heirloom tomatoes and the only place I want flowers on is the main stem as that way they can handle the weight, whereas if I let the suckers grow to produce tomatoes they will end up breaking unless I support them somehow. Plus I would prefer to get fewer but larger tomatoes rather than more smaller ones. Been doing that now for 30 years and that's how I grow all my indeterminate heirlooms. As you mentioned determinate hybrids are a different story but I never grow any.
 
Joined
Jul 28, 2014
Messages
66
Reaction score
30
Location
Almonte Ontario
Country
Canada
I have always heard and understood it that since tomato plants can get rather top heavy during peak fruition and the weight just from the plant itself, burying them deeper allows the extra roots to grow for additional support of the plant/vine..

But to each their own! That is why this is gardening not baking where you use a cookie cutter to make all the same shaped cookies! ... But now I want a cookie!!!
Agreed, tomatoes are very heavy feeders and in my case I grow rather large varieties that can get up to 2lbs so I want as much root mass as I can to not only support the plant but also provide as many nutrients as possible. I plant mine up to 18" deep depending on the height of the plant at the time.
 
Joined
Feb 2, 2014
Messages
11,489
Reaction score
5,591
Location
La Porte Texas
Hardiness Zone
8b
Country
United States
I couldn't disagree more. I grow quite large heirloom tomatoes and the only place I want flowers on is the main stem as that way they can handle the weight, whereas if I let the suckers grow to produce tomatoes they will end up breaking unless I support them somehow. Plus I would prefer to get fewer but larger tomatoes rather than more smaller ones. Been doing that now for 30 years and that's how I grow all my indeterminate heirlooms. As you mentioned determinate hybrids are a different story but I never grow any.
If I removed suckers and limbs below trusses ALL of my tomatoes would have sunscald. As far as weight is concerned here in Texas we MUST use cages or stakes and tie them up. Here ambient temperatures is what determines a tomatoes size. 95F and tomatoes stop getting larger so in high temperature regions size is of much lessor concern than quantity. It has been 95F+ here since mid May.
 

Ask a Question

Want to reply to this thread or ask your own question?

You'll need to choose a username for the site, which only take a couple of moments. After that, you can post your question and our members will help you out.

Ask a Question

Members online

No members online now.

Forum statistics

Threads
26,794
Messages
258,346
Members
13,344
Latest member
amelia2322

Latest Threads

Top