Reflections on compost

[Dora M]

I was wondering what is a really good way to use fresh horse or chicken manure around vegetables. I know that both manures are "too hot" and can infect the soil with bacteria. How do you best store the manure and for how long? Should you mix in some straw while it rests? At one stage I tried to follow a suggestion from a gardening book, trying to make a brew by soaking horse poo in water for a few days. Apparently this water would be "cool enough" after about a week and more potent than the dry manure. But all I got was (and I am sorry if this disgusts you) maggots and very foul water. What's the best way to deal with this "hot stuff"?

 

[Kansas Terri]

I have a source of chicken poo, and I decided to give myself a break and just scatter it thinly. After all, sparrows poo all of the time but their poo does not burn plants because it is scattered! I have some fruit trees and blackberry plants: I set the wheelbarrow several feet away from the target area and I throw the poo with a shovel so that it does scatter. If it landed in a clump it might burn the grass.

I no longer compost anything: I never enjoyed handling a compost pile and so I quit composting. I CAN say that the idea of a compost pile is to help things rot, and if you pile things up and keep it damp they WILL rot! All of the turning the compost and adding this and adding that is just to speed things up. Approach a compost pile with confidence as it is not as hard as the books make it out to be: you simply want things to rot! And they will.

It is unfortunate that poo often has undigested seeds in it: if you are using it in a vegetable garden you might be adding weeds if the pile does not get hot enough. The pile heats up when it is rotting quickly, and sometimes a compost pile does not get hot because it is rotting slowly instead of quickly. That is where the formulas for this amount of green matter or that amount of manure: people want to kill the weed seeds. People also turn the pile at times so that the outer stuff is also exposed to the inner heat of the compost pile to kill any seeds in the outer layer. When the compost INSIDE the pile is cool then it van be used without fear of burning the plants. How long that will take depends on whether or not the compost pile has been kept damp, the ratio of poo to vegetation you used, and some other things.

I never worried much about bacteria, as sunshine kills bacteria and in any case I did not use any poo in my vegetable garden. I simply applied the compost to the trees and bushes and I never thought much about it. Since you say you want to use it on vegetables, I think that I would use it on things like sweet corn and squash. With sweet corn the edible part will never touch the compost, and with squash you can apply compost before the squash is ready to harvest, and then let the sun and the wind break down any leftover bacteria for a few weeks before you harvest.

 

[Dora M]

I have a source of chicken poo, and I decided to give myself a break and just scatter it thinly. After all, sparrows poo all of the time but their poo does not burn plants because it is scattered! I have some fruit trees and blackberry plants: I set the wheelbarrow several feet away from the target area and I throw the poo with a shovel so that it does scatter. If it landed in a clump it might burn the grass.

I no longer compost anything: I never enjoyed handling a compost pile and so I quit composting. I CAN say that the idea of a compost pile is to help things rot, and if you pile things up and keep it damp they WILL rot! All of the turning the compost and adding this and adding that is just to speed things up. Approach a compost pile with confidence as it is not as hard as the books make it out to be: you simply want things to rot! And they will.

It is unfortunate that poo often has undigested seeds in it: if you are using it in a vegetable garden you might be adding weeds if the pile does not get hot enough. The pile heats up when it is rotting quickly, and sometimes a compost pile does not get hot because it is rotting slowly instead of quickly. That is where the formulas for this amount of green matter or that amount of manure: people want to kill the weed seeds. People also turn the pile at times so that the outer stuff is also exposed to the inner heat of the compost pile to kill any seeds in the outer layer. When the compost INSIDE the pile is cool then it van be used without fear of burning the plants. How long that will take depends on whether or not the compost pile has been kept damp, the ratio of poo to vegetation you used, and some other things.

I never worried much about bacteria, as sunshine kills bacteria and in any case I did not use any poo in my vegetable garden. I simply applied the compost to the trees and bushes and I never thought much about it. Since you say you want to use it on vegetables, I think that I would use it on things like sweet corn and squash. With sweet corn the edible part will never touch the compost, and with squash you can apply compost before the squash is ready to harvest, and then let the sun and the wind break down any leftover bacteria for a few weeks before you harvest.

Thank you, Terri. You are a well of information. I am familiar with everything you are saying here. I just think that the precious compost gets wasted if it sits on top of the soil with nothing covering it up. I tend to also directly put cow or horse manure around my vegetables. But first I put down cardboard or paper, then comes the poo, lime, occasionally some blood and bone, and on top of that I put straw. I am not so much worried about weeds. I always have a bit of time to pull them out if necessary.
What concerns me more are the fungi that sprout in the damp, tropical climate. I have to use a shade cloth over my garden and keep renewing the straw a lot during the monsoon month. Everything rots so fast, if I am not careful my entire vegetable bed turns into compost...

 

[Kansas Terri]

WOW! I never realized that parts of Australia were that humid! Here in Kansas the growing season is dry and warm, and so we have only a few fungal diseases to worry about.

You are correct about some of the compost being wasted if it sits on top of the soil I had heard that somewhere.

I always figured that anything water-soluble would be washed into the soil when it rains. We *DO* get weekly rains in the spring, and spring is an excellent time of year to get rid of a winter's worth of hen house poo! I suppose that it would give my bushes less benefit if I scattered the poo when it was hot and dry, but I do not believe that I ever have. Spring time here is an age-old time to clean out the hen house or the barn. It has to go SOMEWHERE, and so spring time is when I have had the chicken poo to scatter under my trees!

 

[Dora M]

Hi Terri, if we continue on this path we will be known as the "poo experts" here. Haha
You sound like you have always been growing things. I like your relaxed attitude. One can get so caught up in all the alleged expert advice written about endlessly in gardening books, when all you have to do is observe nature and have some basic ideas how to create a good environment for your plants. What are you growing this year?

 

[Kansas Terri]

Oh, my vegetable garden is smaller than it used to be but I do love to try new things!

This year my new thing is a heating pad. I got confused and I put the tray with the onion seeds (they like cooler germinating temperatures) on the heating pad and I left the artichokes at a cooler spot: Onion germination was poor but the artichokes are doing well enough!

I have also sent away for Jerusalem artichokes which will be a new plant for me. I am older, and I am no longer well enough to dig root crops, but they sound cool and so maybe just a few! I do love trying new things!

 

[Dora M]

I admit I have never heard about heating pads for sprouting seeds. I know about incubators for eggs, so I guess, why not some warming device to help seeds along. How do you know which seeds need more warmth and which don't?
I am very fond of Jerusalem artichokes. A lot of people mistake them for ginger. I haven't grown any myself, but used to buy them at the local Farmer's market. They taste really delicious. Nutty and crunchy. I like to use them in my stir-fries.