Calcium Hack Thread

[DirtMechanic]

Ok. I'm not 100% this is correct but this is what I came up with.

100% calcium acetate is 25% calcium and 75% acetate by weight.
So you need 3 times the weight of acetate as you do calcium.

100g of eggshells = 38g of calcium so you need 114g of acetate. (38 * 3 = 114)

Vinegar is 5% acetic acid which should equal 4.92% acetate. *Acetic acid has an extra hydrogen atom that has to be subtracted.
So you need 2,317g of vinegar per 100g of eggshells. (114g / 0.0492 = 2317)

So that is a 23:1 ratio of vinegar:eggshells by weight.

My experiment was 10:1 and was still acidic so it wasnt finished breaking down the eggshells which was evident by the eggshells leftover. More vinegar may work faster than less vinegar too but I suspect it will still take a long time to completely dissolve the eggshells to get the full benefit of calcium. If not you may only be extracting a few ppm of calcium and probably not worth the effort.

Or you extract, then neutralize with baking soda or something? Makes sense it would come out hot but then the target is the calcium.

 

[YumYum]

If you were to do 38 g of calcium (100g of eggshells) into 2,317 g (~2,317 ml) of vinegar and it fully dissolves the eggshells so it is now a solution of calcium acetate with a more neutral pH, that is only about 16 ppm of calcium straight out of the jar, assuming I did all the calculations right.
(38,000mg / 2317ml = 16.4 mg/ml = 16.4 ppm of calcium.)

 

[DirtMechanic]

I think the buffering capacity of water to which the solution would be added would modify the pH into acceptable levels given how little available calcium is really needed to be added to a gallon of water for a plant. That is a fortunate thing really and fits into a higher frequency lower dose feeding regimen. Now I am wanting to know a in-soil target for the amount of available calcium. It is suppose to get bound up after a while and that makes it hard because it seems like sand slipping out of an hourglass in terms of amounts available to plants over some time frame or watering volumes over time.

 

[pepper]

I made a dozen and a 1/2 pickled eggs today so I tossed the shells in a old mason jar with cow horn and some deer antler. Curious to see what will happen. Might have to give it a few doses of vinegar then strain in some 100 cheese cloth with water and dry to try to get a little block of it.

 

[pepper]

Does this make sense? My idea is rather then doing exact measurements and waiting 2 weeks or however long for the vinegar to get rid of all it's acetic acid and be left with a liquid concentrate that is added to water for the plants it seems quicker and more convenient to wait for the egg shells to break down then put the liquid in a small pot and boil add a little water and boil it down until almost all the liquid is gone then just add the small amount of liquid to a container and let the liquid evaporate leaving a fully concentrated powder (I am guessing). Continually doing this in the same mason jar, pot and container without washing anything out should give the highest concentrated result of calcium and other minerals with 0% acetic acid left. Because it would be pure there would be no concern of changing the soil PH from remaining acetic acid like there would be if using the liquid method.

The antlers are just an experiment to see if the vinegar can break them down at all. Antlers are 50% minerals and out of that 45% is calcium so they are much better then egg shells (unless you eat a rediculous amount of eggs each week).

Another option would be to add a little baking soda to the mix after it's broken down. The high PH of the baking soda and the low PH of the vinegar should cancel each other out.

 

[DirtMechanic]

Does this make sense? My idea is rather then doing exact measurements and waiting 2 weeks or however long for the vinegar to get rid of all it's acetic acid and be left with a liquid concentrate that is added to water for the plants it seems quicker and more convenient to wait for the egg shells to break down then put the liquid in a small pot and boil add a little water and boil it down until almost all the liquid is gone then just add the small amount of liquid to a container and let the liquid evaporate leaving a fully concentrated powder (I am guessing). Continually doing this in the same mason jar, pot and container without washing anything out should give the highest concentrated result of calcium and other minerals with 0% acetic acid left. Because it would be pure there would be no concern of changing the soil PH from remaining acetic acid like there would be if using the liquid method.

The antlers are just an experiment to see if the vinegar can break them down at all. Antlers are 50% minerals and out of that 45% is calcium so they are much better then egg shells (unless you eat a rediculous amount of eggs each week).

Another option would be to add a little baking soda to the mix after it's broken down. The high PH of the baking soda and the low PH of the vinegar should cancel each other out.

They roast limestone to free the calcium and roast eggshells and such for the same reasons. Seems like a lot of energy, but in a pinch faster.

 

[pepper]

They roast limestone to free the calcium and roast eggshells and such for the same reasons. Seems like a lot of energy, but in a pinch faster.

I'm not sure about the limestone, I want to research that too. But the eggshells roasted is more to keep the skin and any left over egg from going sour if storing the mixture for a period of time. But if reduced to a clumpy powdery form it would last pretty much indefinitely on a shelf.. or at least that is my theory if it works lol

 

[pepper]

I remember in grade school we did a science project where we put a raw egg still in the shell in vinegar. What was left after a while was a rubbery egg with no shell on it. I don't remember the reason behind the experiment.. maybe something to do with acid but I remember thinking how cool the rubbery egg was lol.

 

[DirtMechanic]

I'm not sure about the limestone, I want to research that too. But the eggshells roasted is more to keep the skin and any left over egg from going sour if storing the mixture for a period of time. But if reduced to a clumpy powdery form it would last pretty much indefinitely on a shelf.. or at least that is my theory if it works lol

Cooking limestone is how they make portland cement, quicklime etc.

 

[pepper]

Cooking limestone is how they make portland cement, quicklime etc.

There are a few old limestone kilns here overgrown back in the woods. My grandpa use to tell me stories about them putting lime in bottles and tossing them into the river, they would explode from the water.. I guess that was the quicklime but I forget now.

So if I am understanding I could just use gardeners lime in replacement of the egg shells with vinegar and that would work for calcium?

 

[DirtMechanic]

There are a few old limestone kilns here overgrown back in the woods. My grandpa use to tell me stories about them putting lime in bottles and tossing them into the river, they would explode from the water.. I guess that was the quicklime but I forget now.

So if I am understanding I could just use gardeners lime in replacement of the egg shells with vinegar and that would work for calcium?

What? Be careful! Gardening, via chemical burns, fungal exposure, bacterial exposure, chemical exposure,herbicide exposure, fertilizer exposure etc all risks your dumb approach. Only sober people should garden and that does not include me.

 

[pepper]

What? Be careful! Gardening, via chemical burns, fungal exposure, bacterial exposure, chemical exposure,herbicide exposure, fertilizer exposure etc all risks your dumb approach. Only sober people should garden and that does not include me.

Lol! I am not sure what part you are referring to? If it's the lime in bottles thrown into the river that was something my grandpa told me when I was a kid lol, I have no intentions of throwing bottles of lime in a river not even when I was a kid lol. For the rest of it I am still not sure what you are referring to? If it's the lime in vinegar I was just curious because you were the one that mentioned lime. It's 2023 not 1943, I have plenty of access to science at my fingertips to see if something is true or not so I wouldn't just dump things together because some guy online said to lol. Considering there are literally thousands if not hundreds of thousands of videos and websites etc that refer to mixing egg shells with vinegar as well as something they teach in basic school science I will take the extreme chance I might turn into a french fry or chicken mixing the two components together lol. I honestly have no clue what exactly you are referring to as a dumb approach. If having conversations and loving to learn about science and questioning everything is dumb then I'm the stupidest mofo to ever walk the earth lol.

 

[DirtMechanic]

Lol! I am not sure what part you are referring to? If it's the lime in bottles thrown into the river that was something my grandpa told me when I was a kid lol, I have no intentions of throwing bottles of lime in a river not even when I was a kid lol. For the rest of it I am still not sure what you are referring to? If it's the lime in vinegar I was just curious because you were the one that mentioned lime. It's 2023 not 1943, I have plenty of access to science at my fingertips to see if something is true or not so I wouldn't just dump things together because some guy online said to lol. Considering there are literally thousands if not hundreds of thousands of videos and websites etc that refer to mixing egg shells with vinegar as well as something they teach in basic school science I will take the extreme chance I might turn into a french fry or chicken mixing the two components together lol. I honestly have no clue what exactly you are referring to as a dumb approach. If having conversations and loving to learn about science and questioning everything is dumb then I'm the stupidest mofo to ever walk the earth lol.

Haha- I am just poking on you! I have my own definition of dumb and it has evolved to contain the phrase " I wish I had not done that". I wish I was better at registering experiences others have described in terms of what it could mean to me. Like my FIL getting treated for a lung problem that turned out to be compost spores, then ending up with similar on my feet for barefoot gardening. Or ending up at the eye doctor with ocular dermititus because I was merely brushed by an aggressive curcubit leaf while cutting squash. It is a jungle inside that garden fence.

 

[pepper]

Haha- I am just poking on you! I have my own definition of dumb and it has evolved to contain the phrase " I wish I had not done that". I wish I was better at registering experiences others have described in terms of what it could mean to me. Like my FIL getting treated for a lung problem that turned out to be compost spores, then ending up with similar on my feet for barefoot gardening. Or ending up at the eye doctor with ocular dermititus because I was merely brushed by an aggressive curcubit leaf while cutting squash. It is a jungle inside that garden fence.

I get all that but I personally would chalk it all up to life experience. I would rather have a life of been there done that experiences, learning and experiencing as much as possible about the things I am passionate about. That is what life is all about to me.. there is no room for regret. It's a jungle inside the garden fence but the entire world is a jungle. We are fragile creatures lol.